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Orc Strategies  
folder icon   07-05-2002, 03:26 AM
Orc Strategies Post #1
-G R U N T-

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I don't know any

Please, masters of the game, post them here .

As you can see from my name, I'm a grunt. Yet I suck at orcs. I don't intend for this to be the case for long. SO HELP ME, DAMMIT!

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folder icon   07-05-2002, 04:35 AM
Post #2
McLeod

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Ok, I'll give you some tips, keep in mind that its mostly from my beta expirience.

My build order, also known as McLeod's l33t build:

3 peons mine gold
4th builds barracks (send him to mine gold when done)
5th builds a burrow (builds an altar when done, lumber when done with altar)
6th - lumber
7th - gold
8th - build second burrow when appropriate, meanwhile harvest lumber
9th - dont rush to get him, but add him eventually on lumber

Produce grunts non-stop from the moment you have the rax. There might be slight dealy either becasue of gold, or because of waiting for the second burrow, but its not lethal. Dont rush the war mill, build it only when you have 600+ gold so that you can pump out grunts non-stop. Dont rush the upgrades either, remember that unit poduction is more important. Begin creeping when you have three grunts, add more as they are made.

Now to the hero: If you're using the Farseer, try putting your first point into feral spirit. Attack creeps with wolves first, then grunts, helps to keep them healthy. My skill order: Wolves, CL, CL, Wolves, CL, E, Wolves, FS from then on.

Some general tips:

CL is good against Undead with ghouls and NE with archers. Use it wisely, which means - target the right enemy units. Keep your Farseer away from the front line, or he'll die in seconds.

Bloodlust: get it. As soon as you have upgraded your town hall (which must happen as soon as you have enough resources not to stop unit production and research in WM), build a Lodge and reasarch the adept training. Then, while you're upgrading to the Fortress, pump out shamans. I usualy get three or four of them. As soon as the fortress is ready, upgrade to the master and set BL to autocast. Have fun from then on.

Air: wyverns are good. If the game goes on that long, get a couple of them. If you see your opponent massing pure ground or air, get even more. Use your first wyvern for immidiate recon, if your FS doesnt have far sight yet, or if you cant reach the goblin to use the scope.

Food: always build burrows in advance. Halting your unit prod can and will be deadly in 1v1.

This is a piece of my wisdom for now, ask and you shall recieve more.

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folder icon   07-05-2002, 09:34 AM
Post #3
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I could be wrong, but I've always invested my first skill point in chain lightning, believing that it's better :. Aside from that, your build order and mine aren't too different. I also tend to pump out a lot of grunts . As for the bloodlust thing, that can be tricky. I may need to make adjustments to my strategy. I think I should get 2 spirit lodges. That way, one can build shamans while the other upgrades adept training and later, master training. It sucks, shamans don't get bloodlust until they reach the rank of master >=(

I'd like to hear more on army composition, too. What makes a good army? And how can kodos be used effectively? (Mine always die before they can devour anything OR die promptly after devouring something).

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folder icon   07-05-2002, 10:40 AM
Post #4
McLeod

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Two spirit lodges might be good if you're planning to mass shamans. If you want few of them however, this is a waste of resources and time.

Dont use kodos, they suck. If the game drags along, you might consider building one for aura, but I never bother.

As for effective army, it totally depends on the race you're facing, what units are they using and also which map are you playing. You'll have to ask more specifically, because there is no universal army.

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folder icon   07-05-2002, 06:04 PM
Post #5
K_O_T__tdc

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3 gold
2-build altar and burrow
1 wood
2 gold
Burow done -> build baracks
Altar done -> build burrow
peons on wood until you have 7.
(you can have 6 and send 7th scout if you want).
Build war mill
Your BM with mirror images is done and can go creep with 1 grunt and a few grunts/hhs that you are pumping out until it's 31(food).
At that time your tier2 upgrade is done.
Make Farseer with CL or SW(whatever you need). And a catapult. Get one tower in your town. From here I usually watch the enemy. If he lets you dictate your gameflow go for grunts+shamen+taurens+cats+1wd.
If He has good melle add some wyverns.
If a lot of wyrms,hhs.


K O T
//I add one Kodo when I am done with all the
//upgrades. I add wolves vs NE.

PS: That's not a beat all build, just a moderate one to get you started.
Things like 2 beastiaries(wolves or wyverns)
builds can own this build, so watch out.




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folder icon   07-06-2002, 11:48 AM
Post #6
Sentinel

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How about or strats and build orders for the orcs when playing NE?


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folder icon   07-06-2002, 03:52 PM
Post #7
K_O_T__tdc

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vs NE more grunst and less Taurens.
I would probably stay away from Taurens vs NE alltogather. Wolves are great vs NE, just don't fight their army with wolves!

Fight their expos and buildings and net their fliers. Let grunts(lusted+kodo) do the fighting.

Stasis trap is great if NE goes land.
Wyverns are ok, but not vs a good NE player.

K O T
//As to build orders, well, just make it up
//on your way

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folder icon   07-07-2002, 10:44 PM
Post #8
TheUndertow

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I only make four peons for lumber initially because that gives you a hero and two grunts to creep at 20 supply. The 2nd burrow tends to be to the slow down in the build. I would not advise having more than nine peons total until the 2nd burrow is up, or you won't be able to make the 2nd grunt and you will sit there staring, waiting for the 2nd burrow to finish. Two grunts is enough to kill the weakest creeps.

After that I usually make a mill and the 3rd burrow. Upgrade town hall. Sometimes I make another mill to speed up the upgrades. I usually make two spirit lodges to pump shaman and upgrade at the same time. Shaman are better than headhunters (especially against buildings) and they cast spells, too, so massing them is usually a good idea. Make a couple catapults. Raiders are a little weak right now and I would never make them as a replacement for grunts.

If the game goes beyond that point, I make some tauren and continue with the shaman. You can fill in with wyverns if you want to.

If you can, try to use two heroes. If I pick TC first I go with farseer 2nd, if I pick farseer first I'll go with either TC or BM. Some people like to choose BM 1st with wind walk to kill NE lumber wisps early.

[This message has been edited by TheUndertow (edited July 07, 2002).]

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folder icon   07-11-2002, 09:31 AM
Post #9
-G R U N T-

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*bump*

Anyways, I still can't stand toe-to-toe with a computer all by myself, but I think I'm definitely improving. I've learned several tricks of the trade from watching replays and have (for the first time ever), used a blademaster as my primary hero.

The blademaster (to my suprise), turned out to be a far better hero than I expected. ALthough he lacks the support capabilities of the Tauren Chieftan or the sheer kewlness of chain lightning, he makes up for that with wicked melee capabilities.

I generally put my skillpoints on Mirror Image and Critical strike. I was quite suprised at how effective critical strike was. It only has a 15% chance of dealing bonus damage, so I thought that I'd be lucky to see it in action. To my (pleasant) suprise, my Blademaster performed critical strikes a lot more often than I expected.

My Blademaster strategy (only works in team games, where you have allies to support you) goes something along these lines (note- this isn't very detailed since the game I had was very sloppily played ):

-3 peons on gold
-1 builds altar
-5th peon builds a burrow
(note: I que 3 peons from my Great Hall)
-6th peon on wood
-7th on wood
-8th on gold
-When the peon finishes building a burrow, he builds a barracks
-when the peon building the altar is done, he builds another burrow (later mines wood)

I can't quite recall what happened exactly, so this BO is a LITTLE screwed up. When I could afford it, I built a warmill and started upgrading. WHen I had 3 grunts and my blademaster, I went creephunting (my first skillpoint was on mirror image). Killing low-level creeps with my cadre was no problem, and let my blademaster earn easy experience (I didn't need to waste mirror image on such weal creeps). Instead, I saved mirror Image for when I encountered Ogre lords (often the type surrounded by other ogres) and THEN used mirror image. I sent the image in first to attack the Ogre Lord. That way, while he's stupidly attacking the illusion, my REAL blademaster and his grunts can kill the Ogre lord without interference. After that, his lackeys aren't any problem. THe higher the level of Mirror Image, the more effective this is, since multiple illusions can absorb more damage than just 1.

At the same time I kill creeps for experience (just the ground-dwelling ones), I pump out grunts, tech to beastiaries and get raiders. Once I have 6 raiders with ensare, I enjoy making little hit-and-run raids on enemy expansions and towns. It makes them waste town portal scrolls and makes them nice and paranoid . I tend to lose a lot of raiders this way, but ensaring heroes and a couple other 'choice' units ensures that I can occasionally make a clean getaway .

Skill point allocation for my Blademaster goes as follows:

-Mirror Image
-Critical Strike
-Mirror Image
-Critical Strike
-Windwalk
-Bladestorm

Although I have never had a blademaster who reached level 6, I plan to use windwalk to sneak up to their army and then bladestorm them . SHould be fun.

Also, please note that I really have little experience with this game and that I'm posting this mainly because my big bro has to use the comp for work and I'm really bored.

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folder icon   07-11-2002, 11:28 AM
Post #10
0rc

Critter


Joined: Jul 11 2002
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Long live the orcs

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folder icon   07-11-2002, 01:23 PM
Post #11
Planet_Buster

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Strawberry on the Shortcake

see my post in the "power of the far seer" topic. i dont wanna bother reposting it here, and its not terribly specific on build orders and the like, but i still think its a good strat.

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folder icon   07-11-2002, 10:27 PM
Post #12
-G R U N T-

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I just had a thought- if a tauren gets polymorphed, will the shaman's Purge revert the Tauren back to its original form?

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folder icon   07-12-2002, 10:35 AM
Post #13
Executor

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i think the witch doctor is also very important for orcs... shaman afcource too but ... WD is also very good.. orcs just have awesome spellcasters....

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folder icon   07-12-2002, 12:00 PM
Post #14
TheUndertow

Shaman


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Shaman purge will dispel polymorph, but it will slow the tauren for 15 seconds as well. Orcs don't have a good way to dispel themselves, their dispel is only good against enemies. Wand of negation works best and I would suggest buying a couple if you see a lot of sorc running around.

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folder icon   07-12-2002, 07:01 PM
Post #15
bloodraven

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The build order starts like this:
1) put 2 peons on gold, while queuing up 3 peons in your Great Hall.
2) make 1 starting peon construct a pig farm, and another one to construct a barracks.
3) the first three peons that you make should go to gold immediately.
4) when your farm finishes, make a hero. Use a farseer on most situations, as his chain lightning is very useful early game.
5) put the peon that made the farm on wood, and when the barracks is done, put that peon to make a lumber mill.
6) make 2 grunts.
7) once your farseer is finished, get him and the two grunts to go creep hunting. While this is happening make a couple more peons to
gather wood and to make another farm.
8) upgrade to stronghold asap at this point.

While your stronghold is building, make another barrack while pumping out grunts (headhunters when ur lumber mill finishes) and making
farms when necessary. Once the lumber mill is done, upgrade headhunter's weapon.
..........
.........
.....
...
..
.

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folder icon   07-12-2002, 09:42 PM
Post #16
-G R U N T-

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Do you think that it is a good idea to attack the enemy with a wand of negation and no spellcasters? I mean, bringing along spellcasters like shamans will just be a waste since the wand will negate bloodlust and other friendly buffs as well. If my hero just carries a couple wands, and I attack with a bunch of taurens and grunts, is it possible for me to win through sheer brute force by dispelling all the enemies' negative buffs? (Hence, getting them to fight me on my own terms). Although I don't know if this is very effective.

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folder icon   07-13-2002, 01:11 PM
Post #17
Crusty_-_-Gloves

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Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by K_O_T__tdc:
3 gold
2-build altar and burrow
1 wood
2 gold
Burow done -&gt; build baracks
Altar done -&gt; build burrow
peons on wood until you have 7.
(you can have 6 and send 7th scout if you want).
Build war mill
Your BM with mirror images is done and can go creep with 1 grunt and a few grunts/hhs that you are pumping out until it's 31(food).
At that time your tier2 upgrade is done.
Make Farseer with CL or SW(whatever you need). And a catapult. Get one tower in your town. From here I usually watch the enemy. If he lets you dictate your gameflow go for grunts+shamen+taurens+cats+1wd.
If He has good melle add some wyverns.
If a lot of wyrms,hhs.


K O T
//I add one Kodo when I am done with all the
//upgrades. I add wolves vs NE.

PS: That's not a beat all build, just a moderate one to get you started.
Things like 2 beastiaries(wolves or wyverns)
builds can own this build, so watch out.


</font>

that strat is like mine but this is what i do

3 gold
1 lumber
1 burrow
1 altar

build 3 peons while doing this

send the first one to lumber
second to lumber
3rd to gold

then with the peon that built burrow make a rax

kepp pumping grunts out untill you have 6-10 and go creep hunting with the farseer, feral spirit and 3-4 grunts

then build another burrow with the one that made the altar

then make sure you have 5 burrows

then get beastryx2 and put 2 more on gold then expand

then you should have most of the upgrades from warmill and a fortress so get 2 raiders 2 kodo and then everythinbg else wyverns and attack with whatever yuo have

this should of tooken yuo about 20 mins so you have to hope they don't rush

and this can take out 1 person easy and then just send them overe to the next and kill them

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folder icon   07-13-2002, 01:26 PM
Post #18
Dark Jester

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I never use Wand of neagtion. few people ever put negatice effects on my men. and i would try to keep bloodlust at all costs, it just turns ur melee fighters into crap flinging monkies that eat children and rape women.i use shamans too for the fact stasis trap and healing wards are good. if u look at healing wards wording. it says all friendly units, even tho it puts enemy units in the area of effect and turning them green, they don't get the healing bonus. if i'm not orc i'll sometimes buy the healing wards at a merchant just for the effect. especially since humans and orcs have the worst healing possibilities!

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folder icon   07-13-2002, 03:25 PM
Post #19
Big-Floppy-Llama



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Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Dark Jester:
I never use Wand of neagtion. few people ever put negatice effects on my men. and i would try to keep bloodlust at all costs, it just turns ur melee fighters into crap flinging monkies that eat children and rape women.i use shamans too for the fact stasis trap and healing wards are good. if u look at healing wards wording. it says all friendly units, even tho it puts enemy units in the area of effect and turning them green, they don't get the healing bonus. if i'm not orc i'll sometimes buy the healing wards at a merchant just for the effect. especially since humans and orcs have the worst healing possibilities!

</font>

The worst abilities?? WHat healing do the night elves have that is better than a wand that heals 2% a second for 30 seconds in a decent sized area? I usually have 2 witch doctors with me at all times just standing in the back putting up 2 healing wards. That with bloodlust is a deadly combo.

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folder icon   07-13-2002, 03:30 PM
Post #20
Dark Jester

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wow, well u know, we all know the orcs can run to their burrows and instantly heal their mana and health at early game for pretty much no cost. wow the orcs definitely got that beat.

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folder icon   07-13-2002, 09:31 PM
Post #21
Grom-Hellscream

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I'm hoping that was sarcasm and that I won't have to call you a moron.

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folder icon   07-13-2002, 10:37 PM
Post #22
Sentinel

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Here's my Orc Build Order for the early game. Can anyone tell me ways to make it better?

4 Peons Gold
1 Burrow, then Another
Que up 4 Peons
1 Peon Rax, then Altar
1 Peon Lumber
1 Peon Gold
1 Peon Lumber, then Warmill
From Altar get Farseer and put into Chain Lighning
From Rax Get As many Grunts as possible.
Creep Hunt

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folder icon   07-14-2002, 12:47 AM
Post #23
Zaknafien

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Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by -G R U N T-:
Do you think that it is a good idea to attack the enemy with a wand of negation and no spellcasters? I mean, bringing along spellcasters like shamans will just be a waste since the wand will negate bloodlust and other friendly buffs as well. If my hero just carries a couple wands, and I attack with a bunch of taurens and grunts, is it possible for me to win through sheer brute force by dispelling all the enemies' negative buffs? (Hence, getting them to fight me on my own terms). Although I don't know if this is very effective.

</font>

Bring bloodlust AND a wand of negation. Just dont spray the wand all over the place. Use it for those annoyingh summoned things like skellies and water elementals.

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folder icon   07-14-2002, 10:22 PM
Post #24
-G R U N T-

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Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Zaknafien:
Bring bloodlust AND a wand of negation. Just dont spray the wand all over the place. Use it for those annoyingh summoned things like skellies and water elementals.

</font>

Well then what if the guy is casting cripple, anti-magic shells, etc. I wouldn't want HIS troops to have that advantage. And in the event that he gets summoned units AFTER I bloodlust my troops, I can't use the wand without getting rid of bloodlust as well.

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