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folder icon   05-17-2005, 08:20 AM
Post #71
Grom-Hellscream

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Anyone see the new warrior changes? Pitiful.

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folder icon   05-17-2005, 09:11 AM
Post #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grom-Hellscream
Anyone see the new warrior changes? Pitiful.

Don't complain too much, is better than the crap many classes are getting.

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folder icon   05-17-2005, 11:22 AM
Post #73
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Meh i dont mind them, I can't really find anything that needs to be changed, except for shield bash should knock people over

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folder icon   05-17-2005, 11:32 AM
Post #74
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Actually the new warrior changes look like they will increase the viability of dual weilding warriors. Increased damage is always good, then the added rage generation should be excelent. I love how soon you will be able to tell a warrior's spec by the weapons they weild. 2h =arms, DW = Fury 1h and sheild = Def.

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folder icon   05-17-2005, 12:15 PM
Post #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grom-Hellscream
Anyone see the new warrior changes? Pitiful.


I actually love all the new changes. More rage generation for me in def stance, concussive stun is changed to an instant, so thats one more reliable spell interupt if Ive just use shield bash. Before, i would have to hope that my next attack with that stun attatched would hit before the mob casted.

Deathwish - Is now usable while under a Fear effect, which will also remove the Fear effect.
Overpower - Fixed a bug where the ability was sometimes blocked. Awesomeness, more dmg for me
Improved Cleave - Now increases damage bonus by 40/80/120%.
Blood Craze - Talent design changed. It now regenerates 1/2/3% of the warrior's total health over 6 seconds after being the victim of a critical strike.
New Fury Talent: Dual Wield Specialization - Increases damage with the off-hand weapon by 5/10/15/20/25%. Note: the additional damage also increases rage generation significantly.
Iron Will - Fixed a bug that caused many abilities to ignore the additional resistance. more resisting, wooo
Enrage - Increased the number of charges to 12. Decreased the duration to 12 seconds. The new duration is the limiting factor for slower weapons (e.g. Arcanite Reaper will typically get one less swing), while dual wielding and faster weapons will make better use of all of the charges over the duration of the ability.
Concussion Blow - Changed to an instant, stunning attack and removed the damage portion.
Shield Specialization - In addition to increasing % chance to block, it now gives the warrior a 20/40/60/80/100% chance to generate 1 rage on a successful block.

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folder icon   05-18-2005, 08:56 AM
Post #76
Grom-Hellscream

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Well honestly, the protection buffs (glad you guys are getting some love) and fixes for overpower and such are nice, not complaining there, but I am pissed that they are taking the fury tree completely in the wrong direction. (ie: enrage, dual wield spec)

In the time that you're not using a shield for tanking, you should be aiming for burst damage. This is what 2h weapons are for, and what the fury tree is meant to be used for. They had this line of thinking back in beta, but warriors were a tad too strong with the talents at the time, and instead of finding an alternative, they left it a broken shell of what it used to be - what we see now. Now with an influx of people wanting to be rogues while playing warrriors, blizzard is catering to dual wielding. We're not meant to be dual wielding, both through logic, and straight up math.

Haven't even come close to losing against a DW warrior yet, especially if they use one of the core DW abilities, deathwish.

Crusader: That has always bugged me about shieldbash. Either that, or an uppercut move like Ogres.

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folder icon   05-18-2005, 10:25 AM
Post #77
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*cough*upgradethewarriorguidealready!*cough*

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folder icon   05-22-2005, 05:01 PM
Post #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -G R U N T-
*cough*upgradethewarriorguidealready!*cough*


No =p.


I just hit 54 with my warr around 1:30 A.M. sunday. I'm colelcting the imperial set at the moment. My guy looks hella-lame at the moment because I'm wearing almost all blue, but my chest and legs are purple..I hope to ge tthe battlegear of wrath sometime within the summer >.<

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folder icon   06-01-2005, 12:58 AM
Post #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grom-Hellscream
Well honestly, the protection buffs (glad you guys are getting some love) and fixes for overpower and such are nice, not complaining there, but I am pissed that they are taking the fury tree completely in the wrong direction. (ie: enrage, dual wield spec)

In the time that you're not using a shield for tanking, you should be aiming for burst damage. This is what 2h weapons are for, and what the fury tree is meant to be used for. They had this line of thinking back in beta, but warriors were a tad too strong with the talents at the time, and instead of finding an alternative, they left it a broken shell of what it used to be - what we see now. Now with an influx of people wanting to be rogues while playing warrriors, blizzard is catering to dual wielding. We're not meant to be dual wielding, both through logic, and straight up math.

Haven't even come close to losing against a DW warrior yet, especially if they use one of the core DW abilities, deathwish.

Crusader: That has always bugged me about shieldbash. Either that, or an uppercut move like Ogres.


Um, I dont aggree at all here.

the protection tree, as everyone knows, is made for one hand weapons and a shield. most of the talents are geared for that. no arguments here.

The arms tree is made for Warriors who use a two hander. One look at mortal strike will confirm that, and if that doesnt, there is the hello? two handed weapon specialization? The arms tree is made for warriors who wield a two hander and are aiming for a lot of high damage crits. Sure, a mainly arms warrior will always have some points in the fury tree, such as cruelty and perhaps improved shouts and whatnot, but the tree for two handers is arms.

So, that leaves fury. Fury is the only tree that pre-patch does not have a specialization for a certain weapon usage. However, it does have a shitload of talents that are aimed at getting a lot of crits, and getting them very fast. With the addition of dual wield specialization, which makes off hand damage increase to reasonable amounts, a duel wield fury spec is very viable. In fact, when I copied my character over to the test server and tried out a dual wield fury spec, I had my share of vistories in duels. I can imagine it would also be a good spec for mass pvp, because thats the only time when bloodthirst is really useful.

Not to say that you cant use a two hander with a fury spec, or whatnot... but certainly builds are better for certain things. If you were a mage specced primarily in frost, you wouldnt spend your time doing a lot of fire spells.

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folder icon   06-02-2005, 08:30 AM
Post #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silencer-7

So, that leaves fury. Fury is the only tree that pre-patch does not have a specialization for a certain weapon usage. However, it does have a shitload of talents that are aimed at getting a lot of crits, and getting them very fast. With the addition of dual wield specialization, which makes off hand damage increase to reasonable amounts, a duel wield fury spec is very viable. In fact, when I copied my character over to the test server and tried out a dual wield fury spec, I had my share of vistories in duels. I can imagine it would also be a good spec for mass pvp, because thats the only time when bloodthirst is really useful.


Slam, my friend. Slam was the ultimate fury warrior ability and the basis for the fury tree, similiar to mortal strike is for the arms tree. Slam however, was changed, yet the tree wasn't. So, with the way that warriors are designed and knowing that the fury tree is based around 2h weapons, dual wielding is embracing mediocrity with open arms.

On a side note, dual wield spec is pathetic, as instead of adding percentages, Blizz likes to multiply. Lets say you have a 10min 10max damage axe in your off hand. With the off hand doing 50% damage (negating mob armor), you'd be doing 5 damage with that axe. With dual wield spec (5 points, 25% bonus), you can effectively be doing 7-8 damage with that axe. Mind you, for such a miniscule bonus, you have to spend 5 talent points. This is on par with 2h spec.

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folder icon   06-02-2005, 11:25 AM
Post #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M4tt
No =p.


I just hit 54 with my warr around 1:30 A.M. sunday. I'm colelcting the imperial set at the moment. My guy looks hella-lame at the moment because I'm wearing almost all blue, but my chest and legs are purple..I hope to ge tthe battlegear of wrath sometime within the summer >.<

I was talking to Grom .

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folder icon   06-03-2005, 01:16 AM
Post #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grom-Hellscream
Slam, my friend. Slam was the ultimate fury warrior ability and the basis for the fury tree, similiar to mortal strike is for the arms tree. Slam however, was changed, yet the tree wasn't. So, with the way that warriors are designed and knowing that the fury tree is based around 2h weapons, dual wielding is embracing mediocrity with open arms.

On a side note, dual wield spec is pathetic, as instead of adding percentages, Blizz likes to multiply. Lets say you have a 10min 10max damage axe in your off hand. With the off hand doing 50% damage (negating mob armor), you'd be doing 5 damage with that axe. With dual wield spec (5 points, 25% bonus), you can effectively be doing 7-8 damage with that axe. Mind you, for such a miniscule bonus, you have to spend 5 talent points. This is on par with 2h spec.



But we all agree prot is for 1h+shield, arms is for 2h, what else is left? Fury should be for dual wield...duh.

Yeah, miniscule bonus for 5 talent points ona 10dmg axe, but....there are 1handers out there whose base average dmg is 200.

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folder icon   06-03-2005, 08:21 AM
Post #83
Grom-Hellscream

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200 base damage, eh? Reduced 50%, that's down to 100. 25 damage for 5 talent points is worth it?

Dual wielding is not meant for fury. It's meant for 2h weapons, and where as arms is burst damage, fury is controlled, sustained damage.

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folder icon   06-03-2005, 12:54 PM
Post #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grom-Hellscream

Dual wielding is not meant for fury. It's meant for 2h weapons, and where as arms is burst damage, fury is controlled, sustained damage.


Somehow that doesn't make sense. Fury says to me, berserking person who uses whatever he wants in a senseless and chaotic mode. While arms, is a nice balanced and tactical perspective on the warrior's burst damage. While arms is the patient and humble soak up damage tree.

I'd say that dual-weilding fits perfectly in the fury tree.

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folder icon   06-03-2005, 02:24 PM
Post #85
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I agree. I don't understand why Arms has more to deal with berserking and burst damage then Fury, but as it stands, Fury is pretty passive.

Take into consideration bloodthirst, enrage, flurry, and slam, and notice they are most optimal when using a 2h weapon. They were designed with 2h weapons in mind.

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folder icon   06-03-2005, 05:31 PM
Post #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grom-Hellscream
I agree. I don't understand why Arms has more to deal with berserking and burst damage then Fury, but as it stands, Fury is pretty passive.

Take into consideration bloodthirst, enrage, flurry, and slam, and notice they are most optimal when using a 2h weapon. They were designed with 2h weapons in mind.



Actually the only one out of those that is realyl better suited for two handed weapons is slam, which I believe should be in the arms tree to begin with. Aside from that, all of those talents benefit dual wielding just as well as they do a two hander, if not better. And what about the talents that depend on you attacking faster in order to activate them? I.E. Unbridled Wrath, which is useless for two handers but I've found it is excellent rage gen with dual wielding.

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folder icon   06-03-2005, 07:05 PM
Post #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silencer-7
Actually the only one out of those that is realyl better suited for two handed weapons is slam, which I believe should be in the arms tree to begin with. Aside from that, all of those talents benefit dual wielding just as well as they do a two hander, if not better. And what about the talents that depend on you attacking faster in order to activate them? I.E. Unbridled Wrath, which is useless for two handers but I've found it is excellent rage gen with dual wielding.

Bloodthirst better with dual wielding when it uses weapon damage to account for the hit? Enrage better for dual wielding when a 2h critical can reach 2k+ with ms? Flurry for immense rage generation and faster 2h swings? I strongly disagree. Mathematically, there is absolutely no way dual wielding comes close to being effective.

As for unbridled wrath, the entire concept of spending 5 talent points to have a 40% increase to get a Single rage point is Ridiculous. On par with dual wield spec and 2h spec.

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folder icon   06-17-2005, 01:48 PM
Post #88
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Just a thought, wouldn't dual-wielding make up for the lack of dmg by generating more rage and crit. more often?

What advantages does slam offer? I just got it on my warrior, and it seems kinda useless when I can use heroic strike.

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folder icon   06-17-2005, 02:41 PM
Post #89
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Slam is used with slower weapons and when your enemy is stunned/not focusing on you. You can effectively bypass your weapons swing rate with slam.

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folder icon   07-21-2005, 01:57 PM
Post #90
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Bwahahaha.

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/t...ong&T=42535&P=1

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folder icon   07-21-2005, 11:18 PM
Post #91
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We get it already >.<

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folder icon   07-22-2005, 07:44 AM
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Gah I'd hate to see you when you have Sulfuras and the Alterac Valley 30% damage buff going.

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folder icon   07-22-2005, 11:42 PM
Post #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M4tt
We get it already >.<

That warriors are overpowered? correct!

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folder icon   07-23-2005, 12:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big-Floppy-Llama
That warriors are overpowered? correct!
Hardly.

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folder icon   07-23-2005, 01:18 AM
Post #95
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Yeah, warriors are way overpowered. I damn near almost didn't die the other day while dueling a mage.

I will agree with the Warlock that WoW really doesn't involve much skill. I'm glad I picked a warrior, they're alot of fun, but really, to succeed in this game all you need is 6 hours a day 7 days a week.

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folder icon   07-23-2005, 05:44 AM
Post #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuber8900
Hardly.

Plate armor, high crit rates, insane sustained or burst damage based on how you're specced, high health, one of the best slows in the game, heal prevention, and you call them balanced. Since when was a class that has excellent tanking abilities supposed to be outdamaging classes that were made for dps? When I can nuke, and kite like a mage maybe then I'd consider it balanced.

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folder icon   07-23-2005, 10:27 PM
Post #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big-Floppy-Llama
Plate armor, high crit rates, insane sustained or burst damage based on how you're specced, high health, one of the best slows in the game, heal prevention, and you call them balanced. Since when was a class that has excellent tanking abilities supposed to be outdamaging classes that were made for dps? When I can nuke, and kite like a mage maybe then I'd consider it balanced.
You play a rouge right? You shouldn't complain about us being overpower.

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folder icon   07-23-2005, 10:32 PM
Post #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M4tt
You play a rouge right? You shouldn't complain about us being overpower.

I played a rogue. I play a priest now. I'll laugh if you're calling rogues overpowered.

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folder icon   07-23-2005, 11:01 PM
Post #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big-Floppy-Llama
I played a rogue. I play a priest now. I'll laugh if you're calling rogues overpowered.
Still, you played a rouge. You played someone who can basically negate main-hand weapon speed with SS, you can DW, you have a system of attacking where you gain combos that allow you to do insane amounts of damage, or lower armor or a DoT, or stun for 5 seconds, or increase attack speed by 30%. You also have an ability that basically makes you untouchable for an extended period of time.

We have have Mortal Strike, we have overpower, we have execute, we have battleshout, we have demoralizing shout, we have bloodrage, we 'can' have high crit rates, shield wall, taunt (which doesn't matter 'cause it doesn't work in pvp), and whirlwind.

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folder icon   07-24-2005, 02:30 AM
Post #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M4tt
Still, you played a rouge. You played someone who can basically negate main-hand weapon speed with SS, you can DW, you have a system of attacking where you gain combos that allow you to do insane amounts of damage, or lower armor or a DoT, or stun for 5 seconds, or increase attack speed by 30%. You also have an ability that basically makes you untouchable for an extended period of time.

We have have Mortal Strike, we have overpower, we have execute, we have battleshout, we have demoralizing shout, we have bloodrage, we 'can' have high crit rates, shield wall, taunt (which doesn't matter 'cause it doesn't work in pvp), and whirlwind.


What's your point about the weapon speed? Rogues can use 1h swords/maces up to around 2.6-2.8 speed, daggers from about 1.8-2.0. Warriors can utilize instant abilities with weapons around 3.6-3.8 speeds and you're complaining about weapon speed? If you think combo points give you "insane" damage you're fooling yourself.

Eviscerate (Rank 8)
Finishing move that causes damage per combo point:
1 point : 216-312 damage
2 points: 384-480 damage
3 points: 552-648 damage
4 points: 720-816 damage
5 points: 888-984 damage

See that? Static damage. No weapon, no gear, nothing will change that damage. Rupture: Cool! A DoT that will break gouge and blind, what a great way to remove any chance at keeping a target stunned. Expose armor: Yay, 5 combo points wasted to lower armor only 1700 at max level instead of doing damage. Shame that lowered armor isn't going to make up for the damage the rogue could have caused. Kidney Shot: The other viable finishing move besides eviscerate. Slice and Dice: See expose armor, not going to make up for the damage that would have been caused by eviscerate.

The comment about being untouchable I'm assuming is referring to evasion, to which you can just lay down as many overpowers as you please to promptly destroy the rogue.


MS: Easily 2k crits with the added bonus of them not being able to heal for 10 seconds with only an arcanite reaper (I'll have to get back to you when I get critted with sulfuras now that a warrior has one on the server to see if I get 1 shotted). A rogue doesn't even come close to this fully geared in epics using ambush. Nevermind them not being able to repeatedly use ambush like MS.

Overpower: Already mentioned, insane counter to a dodge.

Execute: Yay, an easy way to finish someone off that's at 20% health. Remind me again which other class gets an I win button at 20%?

Shield wall: Only 25% of damage taken for 10 seconds for a warrior's already high health and armor.

So I offer you this from a caster perspective. Imagine if...
Your crits did 50% increased damage instead of the 100% they currently do.
You could increase your damage only by significantly sacrificing your other stats.
100 agility equalled 1% crit
You had to stand still to attack except for some skills.
Your attacks were delayed ~.5 seconds every time you took damage.
If you were not facing your target at the beginning AND the end of your attack cycle the attack simply would not go off. (Have fun with that server lag)
The ability to keep people in range to attack (Rend) had a very high chance of simply being removed upon damaging the enemy.

Does that sound like fun?

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folder icon   07-24-2005, 12:19 PM
Post #101
M4tt

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big-Floppy-Llama

MS: Easily 2k crits with the added bonus of them not being able to heal for 10 seconds with only an arcanite reaper (I'll have to get back to you when I get critted with sulfuras now that a warrior has one on the server to see if I get 1 shotted). A rogue doesn't even come close to this fully geared in epics using ambush. Nevermind them not being able to repeatedly use ambush like MS.

Overpower: Already mentioned, insane counter to a dodge.

Execute: Yay, an easy way to finish someone off that's at 20% health. Remind me again which other class gets an I win button at 20%?

Shield wall: Only 25% of damage taken for 10 seconds for a warrior's already high health and armor.

You'r dreaming if you think MS will crit for over 2k damage. I roughly do about 600 damge crit at 1,200 to cloth. 500 to leather 900 crit, 400 to mail and about 800 crit, and usually between 300-400 with about a 600 crit.

Overpower: Can still be dodged. And just because we can increase the % to crit doesn't mean we increase the % to hit.

Shield wall: Lasts ten seconds bu by the way, since you're using a 1h weapon
you'll be nerfed out the ass for damage.

Execute: The rouges vanish is easily better than the warriors execute, because 1.) I don't see us disappearing and being able to regen all our energy and using another move that stuns and adds combo point. 2.) We have to gain the rage to take you down, we just don't regen it by sitting there, we actually have to attack, and using MS and all our buffs and debuff nd such will drain it.

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folder icon   07-24-2005, 02:27 PM
Post #102
Grom-Hellscream

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WoW uses the rock, paper, scissors method for its classes, and yes, a mediocre arms warrior will beat a good rogue in pvp because of this method. Just as a mediocre mage will beat a good warrior.

A few overall things I'd like to address considering you're comparing apples to oranges.

First, you mentioned shield wall.

"Shield wall: Only 25% of damage taken for 10 seconds for a warrior's already high health and armor."

Hrm. You make it sound as if we actually do anything damage wise while using this ability. We can't stance dance, and we're limited to purely reactive skills rather then proactive. As well, it's on a 30 minute cooldown, and linked with 2 other abilities.

Now if you want to compare a warrior to rogue in terms of emergency buttons, lets compare. 1 use of button, 30 minute cooldown, linked with other abilities, limited to stance of ability nature vs 6-7 usable abilities on 2-5-10 minute cooldowns, unlinked, potential to use another ability to wipe the cooldowns. Hrm.

Next, warrior damage. We are solely burst damage unless you are an exceptional warrior in terms of equipment and skill. Considering you said you previously played a rogue, I can't even fathom you complaining about our damage if you were laying down sustained damage, and at critical moments, say during a taunt, doing massive burst damage. If you're not outdamaging most warriors, you must be doing something wrong.

And finally, your caster perspective, the most troublesome thing of the entire post. You're comparing the vices of a mana based character to the vices of a health based character, talk about apples to oranges.

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folder icon   07-24-2005, 03:12 PM
Post #103
Big-Floppy-Llama



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Quote:
Originally Posted by M4tt
You'r dreaming if you think MS will crit for over 2k damage. I roughly do about 600 damge crit at 1,200 to cloth. 500 to leather 900 crit, 400 to mail and about 800 crit, and usually between 300-400 with about a 600 crit.

Overpower: Can still be dodged. And just because we can increase the % to crit doesn't mean we increase the % to hit.

Shield wall: Lasts ten seconds bu by the way, since you're using a 1h weapon
you'll be nerfed out the ass for damage.

Execute: The rouges vanish is easily better than the warriors execute, because 1.) I don't see us disappearing and being able to regen all our energy and using another move that stuns and adds combo point. 2.) We have to gain the rage to take you down, we just don't regen it by sitting there, we actually have to attack, and using MS and all our buffs and debuff nd such will drain it.


If you're only critting for 1.2k against cloth you need better gear. I got critted for 2.2k with inner fire up (1600 armor) by a warrior with an arcanite reaper. Swap the reaper out for one of the end game weapons and it's just that much more "balanced".
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Okay, so it can be dodged, hooray? Its still a low rage cost ability that's going to fuck up anyone that dodges you.

Yeah, I know it has to be used in defensive stance, that doesn't really make it crap. Mage saving up a combusted pyroblast, rogue using a cold blood eviscerate, etc. are all wonderful times where sacrificing that damage may be for the best.

And you think rogues don't have to worry about their energy as they vanish? I suppose they could blind (5 min cooldown) before they vanish (5 min cooldown), and cold blood (3 min cooldown) ambush you as a "finishing move". But guess what, they've used all their cooldowns and their reagants! Better finishing move my ass.

And since when was this discussion about rogues, you still haven't justified why you can dps like a rogue, wear plate, and have substantially more health than any other class. Warriors are turning into the new shamans.

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folder icon   07-24-2005, 03:43 PM
Post #104
Big-Floppy-Llama



Joined: Sep 30 2001
Location: A place where llamas thrive
Posts: 6,149 pos

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grom-Hellscream
WoW uses the rock, paper, scissors method for its classes, and yes, a mediocre arms warrior will beat a good rogue in pvp because of this method. Just as a mediocre mage will beat a good warrior.

A few overall things I'd like to address considering you're comparing apples to oranges.

First, you mentioned shield wall.

"Shield wall: Only 25% of damage taken for 10 seconds for a warrior's already high health and armor."

Hrm. You make it sound as if we actually do anything damage wise while using this ability. We can't stance dance, and we're limited to purely reactive skills rather then proactive. As well, it's on a 30 minute cooldown, and linked with 2 other abilities.

Now if you want to compare a warrior to rogue in terms of emergency buttons, lets compare. 1 use of button, 30 minute cooldown, linked with other abilities, limited to stance of ability nature vs 6-7 usable abilities on 2-5-10 minute cooldowns, unlinked, potential to use another ability to wipe the cooldowns. Hrm.

Next, warrior damage. We are solely burst damage unless you are an exceptional warrior in terms of equipment and skill. Considering you said you previously played a rogue, I can't even fathom you complaining about our damage if you were laying down sustained damage, and at critical moments, say during a taunt, doing massive burst damage. If you're not outdamaging most warriors, you must be doing something wrong.

And finally, your caster perspective, the most troublesome thing of the entire post. You're comparing the vices of a mana based character to the vices of a health based character, talk about apples to oranges.


And warriors are the scissors to everyone's paper? Yeah, a good frost mage should be able to beat a warrior, then again, speccing frost for PvP isn't the best build.



Your little warrior buddy mentioned shield wall. Recklessness and retaliation are certainly both amazing abilities on their own.

The thing about the emergency buttons for a rogue, is that they're damn well required to take down many classes. Without stealth a rogue is useless. Without stuns, the rogue is useless. Rogues pretty much need to use their cooldowns to kills other classes. You can't just stand there walloping on someone and expect to win with cloth armor and mediocre health. And in order to utilize the cooldowns best (using preperation) you give up significant burst damage found in a dagger build.

Burst damage is what is needed in PvP. We're not talking about MC bosses with 100k+ health here, and even if we were, warriors are certainly no slouches when it comes to DPS in instances. Yeah, I played a rogue, and when the test server was first opened, if you remember, rogues were doing 2.2k ambushes, and 1.6k backstabs. I was one of those people who saw that as significantly flawed, even playing a rogue and voiced my opinion to get it changed. Now, we see warriors doing that type of damage, and they sit and call it balanced.

I'm comparing the vices of a mana based class to a health based class? Last time I checked, casters still have to worry about health, especially with the damage warriors are outputting these days. Again, justify your plate armor, high crit rates, sustained or burst damage, high health, and one of the best slows in the game.

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folder icon   07-25-2005, 10:20 PM
Post #105
Darkwolf

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Location: Philadelphia PA USA
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Eh BFL honestly, I agree about some points (itemization) but really warriors destroy some classes but get destroed by some. I'd like to see a warrior beat some of the best demology locks. Any class that CC's very well and can outkite the warrior will beat a warrior.

By the way, warriors outdps rogues? Must be some crappy rogues.

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